Beyond the Script: Effective Customer Service Communication

Doug Downs (00:03):

7-year-old Luca Apps made a mistake one Christmas. He got some money as a gift and went out and bought a Lego ninja named JXZ. These are Ninjago in Lego vernacular. He was so excited. But a short time later while out with his dad, the Lego piece fell out of his pocket and he lost his Ninjago with his dad's help. Luca wrote an email to Lego. Hello, my name is Luca and I am seven years old with all my money I bought for Christmas. I bought the Ninjago kit of the Ultrasonic Raider. The number is 9 4 4 9. My daddy just took me to Sainsbury's and told me to leave the people at home, but I took them and I lost Jay-Z at the shop as it fell out of my coat. I'm really upset. I've lost him. Daddy said to send you an email to see if you will send me another one.

(00:57):

I promise I won't take him to the shop again if you can. Thank you. Here's the email reply. Luca received from Lego Customer Service. We're very sorry to hear about you losing your J Mini figure, Luca. I told Sensei Woo that losing your J mini figure was purely an accident and that you would never ever let it happen again. He told me to tell you, Luca, your father seems like a very wise man. You must always protect your Ninjago mini figures like the Dragons protect the weapons of Spinjitsu. Sensei W also told me it was okay if I sent you a new J and told me it would be okay if I included something extra for you. Because anyone who saves their Christmas money to buy the ultrasonic Raider must be a really big Ninjago fan. You will always have the only J mini figure that combines three different js into one. Luca was thrilled. His dad was too and promptly tweeted about it. That social media post went viral with traditional media eventually catching on and making it a global story. Today, odd stories and strategies. You need ninja skills for great customer service, stealth and resolution, agility and adaptability, training, patience and endurance. In the words of Jeffrey Gitomer, you don't earn loyalty in a day. You earn it day by day.

(02:44):

My name is Doug Downs music off the top from the Ninjago soundtracks SO'S True Potential. My guest this week is Priscilla Brooke, joining today from Jacksonville, Florida, home of the Jumbo Shrimp. Hey Priscilla.

Priscilla Brooke (02:57):

Hi Doug. How are you doing?

Doug Downs (02:59):

I'm good. And how are things in Jacksonville and are you football or baseball? What's the top sport down there?

Priscilla Brooke (03:06):

Well, so things in Jacksonville are great. It's nice and sunny today. The big sport I guess in Jacksonville is technically football. We have the Jaguars here. Oh yeah. And I'm a big Jags fan, but you mentioned the jumbo shrimp. That's our minor league baseball team that we have here. But my personal sport is baseball and I'm a big Yankee fan, so that's where my heart lies. But I love the Jaguars, I love the Jaguars.

Doug Downs (03:31):

I share that with you. Baseball hockey's a big deal up here in Canada, but baseball's just more cerebral. It's a pastime.

Priscilla Brooke (03:40):

I love the intelligence that comes along with baseball and the attention to detail. I love it so much. So I've been a fan since I was six.

Doug Downs (03:48):

Speaking of which, attention to detail, Priscilla, you have a background in advertising and a longer background in social media management. You have a Bachelor of Science communication and advertising from the University of North Florida. You're currently the head of podcast support at Buzzsprout, which is a podcast hosting company podcasters and podcast producers like us. We use Buzzsprout to host podcasts the same way you would use GoDaddy or Bluehost, which is used for website hosting. The difference being we podcasters are just much more demanding of that service. We have many, many, many more questions. We use Buzzsprout for almost all of our clients. I seldom have any issues, but the odd time I do, the customer service that I get is really exceptional and quick. And Priscilla, I've mentioned this to you before. I always took that in stride until I heard you do an interview on Buzz Cast, which is the Buzzsprout podcast, talking about your theories and your practices and then suddenly, oh, I realized you're not just nice. There is a scientific and somewhat artful method to your madness when you approach customer service, which is defined by the customer, not by the company in my opinion. So how do you approach customer service with all that in mind?

Priscilla Brooke (05:16):

Yeah, so at Buzzsprout we have a very human approach to customer support. I think that's our kind of our driving force there. We try to always keep in mind that we are people helping people. So we keep things casual. We want our customers to feel really comfortable reaching out to us. We don't want anyone to ever feel like it's a hassle to reach out to support, or that they're not going to get an answer back quickly and they're going to be left on a line. We don't want them to feel silly or embarrassed. And so our driving force is that we're people helping people and we want to have that human interaction be the thing that really sets us apart. And I feel like with support, it's so easy to go into that other kind of lane of it being more ticket based and here's your number and this is always refer to this number or else we're going to have no idea who you are.

(06:09):

That kind of stuff. It makes you feel like transactional a number. Exactly. And so we lean the other way. We want people to feel like they have a team of people on their side helping them. You're a podcaster. Podcasting can be very solo. It can feel like a very solo sport. And so you're kind of in your own world working on it. And then if you need help, it's, it can be hard to find someone to help you. And so we want to be that team for our podcasters. So if you ever feel like you're in the middle of something you can't figure out, we want you to know that you have someone to go to. You have a group of people to go to that are going to get back to you quickly and that are going to take care of you the way that you should be taking care of by this company that you're hosting your podcast with.

Doug Downs (06:52):

So most of the times I would contact customer service is when the directions clearly say click the 7 1 4 2 orange button. Or they say, use the 7 1 4 2 orange wrench if I'm putting together something from IKEA and there is no 7 1 4 2 orange button or wrench. And that's when they forgot to include it. So that's when I would contact customer service. How do you, talking about the psychology of interacting with customers, how would you manage that? Just say, here it is, or would you do that little softer?

Priscilla Brooke (07:31):

I think there's something about education versus just support when it comes to customer service. So one thing, it's kind of that teach man to fish saying, teach Amanda, I don't remember what exactly it is, but if you teach him to fish, he can eat forever, something like that. But it's that idea of yes, if you say, I don't know where this wrench is, help me find it. They can help you find it or they can get you the right wrench. But we try to go a step beyond that with the education of it. We want you to know why you need that wrench. We want you to know a little bit more of what's going on so that the next time you need it, you know where to find it. You know how to get yourself because we don't want you to be reliant on support. We want to build our products in a way that you actually don't really need support until you're in a situation where you're stuck and then we want to come in and help you learn and grow. And so we kind of focus on that education side of things a little bit in support as far as our philosophy of how we work with podcasters.

Doug Downs (08:32):

The challenge with that is you're not churning out the responses. You can't at the end of the day say, Hey, I spent three seconds on this, I spent five seconds. You're spending more time up front.

Priscilla Brooke (08:42):

We are, yeah. I will say I've been with Buzzsprout customer support since 2017, so for a while, and in the beginning when we had fewer people on the team, the focus was speed. It was always, we're going to go as fast as we can. We want to get this out as fast as possible. We want good quality answers. But speed is most important. And I think what we've learned over the last seven years is that while speed is important, people want to quick return. There's also going that extra step above and providing the excellence in support and that's where that time and education come in. And so you do put a little bit more time in that first response back with someone, which might mean that they don't get an answer in five minutes. They might get it in 10 minutes, but we have found that that provides a better experience if someone has to wait a little bit longer, but they're getting something that's more thorough and that's more personally tailored to them and what they're dealing with. And that gives them the tools to go out and be a better podcaster. That's what we're trying to do in our support.

Doug Downs (09:50):

And how important is it the customer feels understood at the very beginning of the interaction?

Priscilla Brooke (09:57):

It's probably the most important thing period. I mean, it goes back to what I was saying about we're people helping people. We're all human and all of us have this need to want to be understood and cared for. I mean, I think that's most basic. And so if you're working with anyone, whether you're in a support role or whether you're in your carwash and you're paying the person who's washing your car, whatever it is, everyone wants to be treated with that same level of understanding and care. And so when we have someone who writes in into support, our main goal right up front is to connect with them on a personal level to let them know that we understand where they're coming from to see things from their side, from their point of view, from their side of the fence is what I was going to say.

(10:43):

But I don't know if that's a saying really. But anyway, but we try to put ourselves in their shoes. That's really kind of, empathy is a driving force in our support team. And so that is really what we focus on is putting that right up front at the beginning of the email so it sets the tone for our conversation with this person so that they know right from the get go, we're on their team, we care about them, we're here to help them, and we can answer any questions big or small and help them learn what they need to learn.

Doug Downs (11:14):

So then just briefly, tactically using that strategy of empathy and understanding, if I were to email customer support and say, I can't find the 7 1 4 2 orange link that I'm supposed to click on. I think you forgot to put it in there, craft that email response for me so I can learn. Would you say, oh, here it is, here's a link to it, or would you do it a little differently?

Priscilla Brooke (11:36):

So first I would say, here it is, I'm always going to answer your question right up front. I'm going to say, here's the link, here's a screenshot to how you get to it. If you ever need it in the future, here's where you can find it. And then I'm going to give you a little bit more context around that link and what it's used for and what our recommendations are for using it. And so that way if you're in a quick, you got to get out quick, you can read that first paragraph, get the answer you need and move on. Or you can kind of read a little bit more into the email and understand a little bit more about how we recommend using a feature. A good example of this within Buzzsprout is our dynamic content tool. It's a tool that allows you to drop content into your episodes and it kind of is time sensitive.

(12:23):

You can take it out and you can drop it in at any point. A lot of people don't understand the intended uses for that tool, and so they'll write in with questions about how to use it for a very specific thing that they're trying to do. So we'll tell them how to do it for that, but then we will give them a quick understanding of what the intention behind that tool is. Of course, you can use it however you want to use it. It's for you to use, but if you're trying to hammer a nail into the wall with a wrench, it's not going to go as well as if you're using a hammer. Excellent. So that's kind of how we go about it is we want to lead into the education a little bit more than just that kind of run of the mill support.

Doug Downs (13:06):

How has the approach to customer service evolved over the last 20 years, even over the last 30 years? Obviously the tools are different. It's predominantly email now. It used to be by phone. We have video platforms now, but how has that evolved and does that result in customer service experiences being different for the different generations? In other words, do boomers expect one kind of customer service? Do Xers like me expect something? Millennials, gen Z alphas?

Priscilla Brooke (13:40):

Yeah, I alphas. That's so crazy. All these different, it's crazy to me. Yeah, I think that early years and years ago when these kind of tech companies were becoming more popular, I think the support was a necessary thing, but it wasn't necessarily something that was celebrated or at the forefront

(14:07):

Kind of thing. Yeah, it was an afterthought, right? An afterthought of your, you need to have it because you have to have someone who can answer an email, but it's not the important thing. The important thing is the product. That's the thing that you have to, and so I think the shift over the last 20, 30 years is that people are realizing how much of an impact your personal connections with your users has on who uses your product and if they stay with your product or if they go to a new service. And so I think people are realizing that your support team is such a big part of that. And so I feel like I'm seeing people really invest in that support more than they were before and making sure your support team is supported by the company and making sure that support team has a voice in product development.

(14:56):

I know for Buzzsprout, our co-founders do a really great job of making sure that support is part of the product. It is not this afterthought. It's not in the basement. There's a show called Mythic Quest, which is very funny, but their support person is in the basement and no one talks to her and she's all by herself and she never comes out and she just answers emails all day. And I think that's how a lot of bigger companies handle support. And so we try really hard to make sure that support is part of the product. It's in the product development meetings. We have a lot of really great insight because we are the ones working with our users. We get their feedback, and so we are enabled and encouraged to share that with the team and be part of those conversations. So I think that is a big kind of change that's happening and has happened in the last several years. You mentioned phone support and email support. We strictly do email support, which is interesting. We have a lot of people who will write in and really want phone support, and our default is email and sorry,

Doug Downs (16:07):

Is that the boomers and the Xers that want someone on the phone? Yes.

Priscilla Brooke (16:10):

No, you're right. It absolutely is. The older generation, they want someone to get on the phone and when you won't get on the phone with them or if you don't offer that, they will leave. They'll bounce. We'll see that people, because if you can't convince them that email support is going to be a great avenue for getting the help they need, they'll leave. And so many people have been burned by not having phone support in the past that they just assume that all email support is bad. So I'm not even going to give this time of day, but younger people, these maybe not the generation Alpha, but your Gen Zs and your millennials, I think they much more want, tell me where I can find this so that I can figure it out myself. I don't need you to walk me through step-by-step. Every little thing I want you to give equip me so that I can figure it out. Whereas some of the older generation wants a little bit more of the handholding, at least what I've seen. Of course, these are generalizations and there's outliers in both sides, but I think that generally the older generations want a little bit more step-by-step guides probably because they didn't grow up with tech the same way that millennials and Gen Zs have.

Doug Downs (17:26):

Totally. And I guess as an Xer, I can always blame the younger generation for building the tech, and that's why it's not understandable. So someone should get on the phone and explain it to me. Well,

Priscilla Brooke (17:38):

Yeah, and it's so funny. I think I'm a millennial and when I was a child, I didn't have a phone. I didn't know anything about tech. Not until I was in college. I really have my own cell phone and start learning about that. But my niece, who is Alpha, she has known how to take videos on her phone or on her iPad since she was like four. And it's crazy to me just the way that technology impacts for better and for worse,

Doug Downs (18:11):

It's empowering the younger generation is going to solve problems because they're investing and understanding it now.

Priscilla Brooke (18:17):

That's how I see it, and it's a language, it's like learning a language when you're young, always. My mom is pretty technical. She's pretty technically savvy, but sometimes I have to walk her through some things, but it really is like a language that she doesn't know as well as my niece who knows it fluently because she has always had to speak it.

Doug Downs (18:39):

So if customer service has this higher evaluation to it, as companies are building their strategies and their approach, how do you feel about those programs where I can sign up for the gold membership and someone will get back to me in 24 hours on customer service, or I can sign up for the platinum membership and someone will respond within 12 hours, or I can sign up for the elite membership and someone will give blood or donate a liver to save my life, nevermind responding immediately to my, how do you feel about that tiered level of customer service?

Priscilla Brooke (19:16):

I don't love it personally. I think that if we're trying to make sure that everyone feels cared for and understood, and the first thing you hear is, oh, well, I'm on the bottom tier, so I automatically be cared for less than the person who's on. Yeah, I don't love that idea. I understand in some ways why that might be necessary depending on how many customers you have and wanting to offer a really high service to some people. But I personally don't like that approach. The way we do Buzzsprout support, we try to kind of focus on the people who haven't heard from us yet, and so we'll focus on that, but we really try to look at everyone on the same playing field. We try to answer everyone quickly. Sometimes that means that some people wait a little bit longer because we're busier, but we don't do that kind of class system and I just don't love that idea of making some people start from a lower line than the next person. Everyone deserves the same excellent support.

Doug Downs (20:22):

Got it. It's not a splitting point in terms of the value that the company or the product or the service should bring. I got you. Okay. So I think I've learned from you. I think I share your values first of all, but I've learned from you on the strategies and some of the tactics on customer service. I was hoping that you would help me test me, give me a customer service problem, and I will try to craft the email response that I would write back to the customer. You game?

Priscilla Brooke (20:55):

Yeah, let's do it.

Doug Downs (20:56):

Alright, let's try.

Priscilla Brooke (20:57):

Okay, so, okay. When I was thinking through scenarios, I kind of put some questions beforehand when I was thinking through scenarios. I know I decided to stick kind of in the podcasting world because you work a lot in podcasting, and so trying to kind of stay in your niche a little bit. And I'll start with the first one. We'll see how many we get through. So the first one is, Hey Doug. I've been recording episodes consistently for over a year, but my audience isn't growing. I get about 200 consistent downloads per episode, but I'm starting to burn out. What do I do?

Doug Downs (21:26):

This is first of all a really common expression from podcasters and one of the most frustrating things is growing your podcast. You should be hearing that and reading that universally. I understand. I to diagnose specifically what may or may not be happening or the opportunities you may or may not be missing. I would love to get together online and chat with you. That's not what I'm supposed to do here, right? I'm supposed to be totally by email. I get caught in a diagnosis world here where I don't want to prescribe an answer because I really haven't diagnosed

Priscilla Brooke (22:06):

What

Doug Downs (22:06):

The issue. So it's malpractice.

Priscilla Brooke (22:08):

Yeah. You want to learn more about what they're doing currently and you want to figure out where they stand now and give them some different ideas to go different ways. But I think the most important thing that I see in this scenario is that they're saying they're starting to burn out, but they've also been recording episodes for a year and they're getting 200 downloads an episode. Yes, that's good. And they're feeling burned out and they're feeling disappointed in that. And they need to be reminded that that actually is really good and you should be proud of it. And if you need to take a break, you should take a break and make sure that you're at a place where you can do it and you're excited about it. But if 200 downloads is something that you're not seeing as successful, then you need someone to come in and remind you that that's really successful.

Doug Downs (22:56):

I could give them, you have a wonderful chart that outlines the median average

Priscilla Brooke (23:02):

On our global stats page.

Doug Downs (23:03):

Yeah, I could provide them that. Give them a sugar cookie saying That's actually awesome. Was the expression of empathy good off the top there?

Priscilla Brooke (23:14):

Yes, absolutely. Yeah. Letting them know that they're not alone in that. So many people run into this. I think that's great. One thing that I will tell podcasters is if they say something like that, we have 200 consistent downloads, but I just don't feel like it's going anywhere. I'll say 200 people. Imagine if 200 people came to your house to listen to you speak, you would not be able to get them all in your house. Imagine if you went to, you taught a class and 200 people showed up. That's so many people, and we forget about it. When we look at it on a stats page and see 200, we think, oh man, it should have been 2 million, but 200 is a great number. And so I feel like that's a lot of times what I try to do is remind them that 200 people physically is much more than you think. If you're looking at the stats.

Doug Downs (24:01):

Yeah. Don't get lost in the Joe Grogan numbers. Joe Rogan's a unicorn.

Priscilla Brooke (24:05):

No. Yeah. I don't know how he'd feel about you calling him a unicorn though.

Doug Downs (24:11):

Yeah, I don't know. He might love it.

Priscilla Brooke (24:14):

He might love it. You're right.

Doug Downs (24:15):

A different kind of guy.

Priscilla Brooke (24:18):

Okay, so next question. Alright, so let's see. All right. I've been solo podcasting for a while, but I want to start having guests on my show. How do I go about finding guests?

Doug Downs (24:30):

Fantastic idea. And I trust the solo podcasts have been going well, and this is a sign of the growth of your podcast where you're looking to branch out and include some other formats and ideas. Great. I think I would Sprout has some pieces online that discuss the differences between Solo and between a guest focused podcast. I know I've done a YouTube video on this where I break it down myself. So I myself would send them my YouTube video, which breaks down where each strategy depends on what your podcast is intended to do for your business. What I've missed there is because the question was how not should I, so I should address better the how is to identify your niche audience, who they want to hear from. Then you might explore other podcasts and who have they had as guests on their show, subscribe to newsletters that fit that niche and who are the subject matter experts and invite them to be on your podcast. Then I could have expanded into my other stuff.

Priscilla Brooke (25:46):

Well, no, I think that's great. And sometimes when I'm writing an email, I'll rearrange things at the end depending on the flow before I send it. So that's all right. You're speaking it all, but you got that one. Again,

Doug Downs (25:56):

Touch the button that they ask first. That's what I should have done there.

Priscilla Brooke (25:59):

Yes, touch the button that they ask first. Absolutely. But I think what you were saying was good using your materials that you already have, that's a great way to further educate someone. Sometimes what we'll do is we'll recommend third party services. So Pod Match, for example, is a website that will help you get connected with guests for your podcasts. So if our main goal is to get the podcaster to have a successful podcast, that's our main goal here. So even if that's not something that directly Buzzsprout is giving them, so Pod Match is a third party, but we're going to use that resource to help them get, and so kind of utilizing those outside resources can really help. And so like you were saying with your YouTube video, that's a great way to further educate them. Using a third party like Pod Match and pushing them in that direction is great. And then encourage encouraging them on ways to perfect their interview style or their questions. And so sending them those kind of things to continue that on so you're answering their specific question and then you're giving them kind of next steps from there so that they know where to go.

Doug Downs (27:16):

I really appreciate your time today and all the times that we've interacted.

Priscilla Brooke (27:20):

Yeah, thank you so much for having me on. It's been really fun to have this conversation with you. It's fun to be on a podcast with you. I don't do a ton of podcasts personally, but it's exciting because I am launching a podcast, or I guess by the time this gets released, it will have been launched all about customer support. So it's with the people of Buzzsprout. We are launching a podcast called Happy to Help about customer support and how to have that excellent experience for your listener or for your podcasters or your users. It's not specific to podcasting, so it can be anyone who is currently a support specialist with a team or if you lead a support team or if you have a company that has a support department. The goal for this show is really to be a resource for anyone who is working in customer support in any capacity. And so I think this is releasing in early April, and so the podcast will have just launched this week, so if any of your listeners are interested in it, they can find it on Apple and any directory that they use or happy to help@Buzzsprout.com will be our website so they can head over there to find the Happy to help podcast.

Doug Downs (28:36):

That's awesome. And there's a link to Priscilla's podcast in the show notes, so please strong recommend three thumbs up. Yes,

Priscilla Brooke (28:44):

Thank you. Thank you.

Doug Downs (28:45):

If you'd like to send a message to Priscilla Brook, best way to do that is through the Buzzsprout customer support email. That too is in the show notes. Stories and Strategies is a co-production of JGR Communications and Stories and Strategies podcasts. We're also on YouTube and YouTube music, full audio episodes, and we publish short video segments as well. We would love it if you'd subscribe there and help us grow. We're kind of startup there. Lastly, do us a favor forward this episode to one friend. Thanks for listening.