Why is My CEO so BORING on Social Media?

Doug Downs (00:09):

I want to take you back to the winter of 1929. Franklin Delano Roosevelt wasn't yet the man the world would come to know as FDR, the four term president, the wheelchair bound warrior, or the steady voice of calm in troubled times, no, back then, he was the newly minted governor of New York standing on the cusp of a nation trembling under the first cracks of the Great Depression. But Roosevelt wasn't worried about Wall Street that day. He was wrestling with a more personal problem, how to reach people. You see, politicians in those days did what politicians had always done. They wrote speeches for newspapers. They stood on stages projecting the crowds, but Roosevelt understood something many of his peers did not. People were scared, tired, and angry. They weren't reading long editorials, they weren't attending rallies, and most importantly, they weren't being heard.

(01:13):

It was in those early days in Albany that Roosevelt tried something daring for the time he stepped away from the podium, away from the Press Corps and into the living rooms of New Yorkers over the radio. His first address was a simple one, an explanation of a complicated budget. But what caught everyone off guard wasn't what he said. It was how he said it. His voice was warm, intimate, like a neighbor, leaning across a picket fence. For the first time, listeners didn't feel like they were being lectured to. It felt like they were being invited. This wasn't Roosevelt's invention. No. His wife, Eleanor and his advisors had long urged him to take advantage of the new medium of radio what Roosevelt did. Next turned radio into an art form. He wrote the speeches himself, crafting words in the way a father might explain something to his child without pretense, without jargon. And he rehearsed them over and over, not for perfection, for connection. Fast forward to 1933. The country was on its knees. Banks were failing. Families were losing homes, redline stretched for miles as newly inaugurated. President Roosevelt needed a way to stabilize the nation's confidence. And he remembered something from those days in Albany. He remembered how his voice, just his voice, could make people feel less alone. And so on. March 12th, 1933, America gathered around their radios. Roosevelt began his first fireside chat by saying, my friends

Franlin Delano Roosevelt (03:01):

Let us unite in banishing fear. We have provided the machinery to restore our financial system, and it is up to you to support and make it worse. It is your problem, my friends, your problem no less than it is mine. Together we cannot fail.

Doug Downs (03:20):

And suddenly the vast chasm between the White House and the smallest farmhouse in Iowa disappeared. Over 60 million Americans listened, and the next day, thousands of people who had hidden their savings under mattresses walked into banks and deposited their money again. Roosevelt continued these chats throughout his presidency during the Depression and into the dark days of World War ii. Each time he spoke not as a distant figure of power, but as a trusted friend. And through those crackling radio waves, he accomplished something extraordinary. He made the presidency personal today on stories and strategies, encouraging leaders to trade in a little polish for a little more personality. We may not be looking for someone anymore to spare a dime, but we are looking for leaders to spare a little time.

(04:29):

My name is Doug Downs music. Off the top, we played Brother Can You Spare Dime from the 1932 musical Americana lyrics by Yip, Harburg and composer Jay Gorney. The music itself is actually based on an old Russian Jewish lullaby, so that's neat. A couple of thank yous off the top, I want to thank a crop in Australia. Left us a five star rating on Apple podcasts in Australia, and Acrop says, Doug just has a way of talking about the issues that impact our profession. Great questions, high energy. Keeps everyone engaged. That's the coffee. That's the coffee. Well done on a great podcast. Thank you for that, Acrop. Really appreciate it. And on LinkedIn, Daryll Winwood left a message and tagged us in it. Really enjoyed the recent episode, talking to the head of digital communications for nasa. Lots of relevance from my own work with Alberta Innovates, talking about communicating science, and we need more of that. Daryl, now that I'm thinking, I'm going to send you a link to an episode we did about three years ago. That's all about communication for sciences, and it was done with Laurentian University. They have a course on that. My guest this week is Jess Jensen, joining today from Portland. Hey Jess.

(05:48):

Hello.

(05:49):

How are things in Portland now? Do you get snow at this time of year? And is it just that light blanketing that will disappear on a warmer day? What's it like

Jess Jensen (06:01):

There? No snow yet, although we will get a week, maybe two if it's a cold winter, but more in January, February.

Doug Downs (06:09):

Jess, you've got 20 years marketing communications experience inside Fortune 500 brands like Nestle, a datas, Qualcomm and Microsoft. Deep expertise in digital and social marketing, executive communications and team leadership. Your company is co-pilot communications, which it's one of those names. When I saw it, I said, oh yeah, I like that one. So it's about the journey together, right?

Jess Jensen (06:32):

Absolutely.

Doug Downs (06:33):

Love it, love it. So just there are lots of understood reasons now why execs should be using their voice in digital spaces like social media, building authentic connections, enhancing brand visibility, establishing their thought leadership, which they're always kind of keen to do. Making sure the information that's out there about you is correct, which is a growing thing, getting feedback from your key stakeholder base and humanizing the leadership of the brand overall. Are they doing it though? Are they succeeding with that and are they picking one or two of these that they think are more important? What's the status?

Jess Jensen (07:15):

Yeah, so many things. There's a wide spectrum. I mean, we know that a majority of C-suite and senior leaders are on social now in 2024, although that maybe wasn't the case five, six years ago. So the progress has been made in terms of just them joining the party. Now, how they're leveraging those tools is another broader conversation. So there's definitely some that are still sort of spending time using those tools in more of a traditional PR methodology. So sharing out a synopsis of earnings calls, perhaps a shorter version of a press release about a product launch. I think that's fine, but I don't necessarily believe that that's leveraging the community aspect and the immediate feedback and dialogue that you get on social properties to its fullest extent.

Doug Downs (08:12):

So what I'm hearing there is they've dipped their toes into the water, but they ain't swimming yet. They're still kind of playing it safe the way execs are want to do.

Jess Jensen (08:23):

Definitely the majority are. There are some notable exceptions. I brought two with me just as examples if you'd like to hear.

Doug Downs (08:30):

Yeah,

Jess Jensen (08:32):

So one on LinkedIn, Frank Cooper. So he's the CMO Chief marketing officer of Visa, and I think he does a great job. He's got a really diverse, interesting background. He worked for Def Jam, Def Jam Records Pepsi, so he's got a big deep interest in music and pop culture, and he weaves that into his personal interests and those things into a lot of his, and then at times ties it to Visa, but at other times it's not. It's just sort of his interest in those things. He also does some fun stuff around kind of video and charting out a day in the life as he's traveling, say to China or other markets.

Doug Downs (09:11):

So behind the scenes kind of stuff.

Jess Jensen (09:14):

So I think he really, he uses video well, he uses his personal interests outside of work. Well, to kind of paint a fuller picture of who Frank is besides just the CMO of Visa,

Doug Downs (09:26):

Love it. Who's the other one?

Jess Jensen (09:28):

The one that I like a lot is very prominent on Instagram. So Sarah Blakely,

(09:34):

So she's the founder of Spanx and I believe the youngest self-made female billionaire in America. Now. She has a new company that's a shoe line called Sneak. But regardless of the product she's selling, she just uses Instagram again in a very human flaws and all way. She'll show herself in the backyard having just a conversation around their swimming pool with her dad and her husband's friends, and they're just in regular clothes talking about things, reminiscing of trips they've taken or lessons they've learned. She has a kind of famous coffee cup sort of photo series where she holds up the coffee cup with quotes on it. Anyway, I feel like she shows herself learning and trying and making mistakes in ways that many CEOs, especially at that level won't necessarily do.

Doug Downs (10:30):

There's some really good examples there. So I don't need to be Elon Musk and kind of pushing the envelope and deliberately trying to get sometimes because I actually like Elon, but deliberately trying to get on people's nerves. I can just be me and show people behind the scenes stuff.

Jess Jensen (10:48):

Yeah, I think being controversial and edgy is certainly one way to get attention and to get engagement, but I'm sure, well, so much of it is just about who you are, and if your personality perhaps is already someone who's kind of edgy and controversial, that's who you are. So show it. If your personality is something different, let that come through and be that

Doug Downs (11:12):

Human. You gave two examples there, and you specifically said Frank Cooper on LinkedIn and the second one on Sarah Blakely, I think I said that right on Instagram. They've chosen their channels deliberately and they, I'll call it broadcast, but it's not really broadcast. They publish materials specific to those channels. LinkedIn perhaps more want for telling stories. Instagram is really a video slash photo album that you're kind of displaying at the same time that has some abilities. How do I decide which channel is right for me? And it's not matter of just spraying all the channels and hope and I connect on all of them.

Jess Jensen (11:59):

Great question. There's no perfect answer. But the first place I go and often where I would guide my clients would be, where do you believe that your target audience is spending the most time? So for example, for my business, I'm really targeting and hoping to work with partners and clients that are at a very senior level in their profession. And I don't mean to say that they aren't on Instagram, for example, but they probably are using Instagram maybe for more personal reasons.

Doug Downs (12:31):

They're scrolling. Yeah,

Jess Jensen (12:32):

They're scrolling, right? Or they're sharing photos of their family or trips, what have you, and that's great, but part of me doesn't want to interrupt that. That's sort of their space. So I lean in on LinkedIn from a social perspective because I truly believe that is where a lot of my audience is spending time and where I perhaps can get a little bit more of their attention from a business perspective.

Doug Downs (12:55):

Love it. I was on LinkedIn yesterday, and I'm lucky. I am connected too, and I follow lots of great executives, some I've worked with, some have just caught my eye and I like to follow. But let me read you a sampling of what I read literally the other day. Number one, I'm happy to share. I've obtained a new certification, such and such certification from the Ivy Academy at Ivy Business School. Number two, today we're thrilled to announce company's name, latest partner, partner name, and number three. I'm very fortunate to work with such a great team at company name to provide customer and communities with description of our service. Thank you, name of municipality and our industry partners for such a warm welcome. I'm going to go so far as to say, I did not hear one authentic word or a word with personality that's in there. They are playing it. If any of those caught your eye, how would you tweak them? How would you advise these executives on how to make a realer connection?

Jess Jensen (14:05):

Yeah, yeah. You bring up such a good point. Again, it's funny, it's like we're happy that senior leaders and influencers and executives at the highest level have joined that party. We're happy that they're there because we're there, but we want them to be more full, more and maybe allow some of the edges to show once in a while. And I understand it takes courage. I mean, it can be very scary, especially when you're looking after a multiple tens of thousands of people. If it's a publicly traded company, there's a lot of risk with what you say in terms of moving the stock price or altering relationships with customers. So I get that there's risk, but I believe that any of those lines that you just shared could be altered by first asking, how is this of service to my audience?

(15:03):

I believe that if you come at, and this isn't just social, this could be in a podcast format, could be up on stage if you're doing a keynote, that if you start with the what is it that I want the audience to feel or think, walk away remembering and how is that either entertaining? How is it emotional? How is it useful and practical? If you start first with the beginning, with the end in mind, and then you reverse engineer your way out of that in terms of what you're going to write or say. I believe that that is much more resonant with whoever is reading what you posted.

Doug Downs (15:42):

That is so spot on. You need to tap into the emotions of some kind, humor for some anger. That's how folks like Elon Musk and Donald Trump, and I'm sure others on the Democrat side have done it through promoting anger. Things like the agitating of Mark Cuban does that quite a bit. And the other channels that you talked about, because the reality of social media is we are spending a ton of time, I think it's 80%, 80% of us are on a social media channel of some kind, and we spend two and a half hours a day statistically. But the reality is we're soaking up very little. We're scrolling like mindless drones and social media engagement is continually in decline. So those other channels, you mentioned podcasting, which I love, but YouTube and newsletters, what are some of the different ways email blasts, what are some of the different ways that executives can make that personal connection and not just on boring old social media?

Jess Jensen (16:49):

It feels like social is kind of in that.

Doug Downs (16:52):

It's getting old,

Jess Jensen (16:52):

Right? Yeah. It's been around now for 20 years. Isn't that crazy to think?

Doug Downs (16:56):

Yeah.

Jess Jensen (16:57):

So you said it really well before we were chatting, before we got on, and I loved the way that you framed it. Social can go broad, but it's fairly shallow in most cases, unless

Doug Downs (17:10):

They don't spend much time with

Jess Jensen (17:11):

It, unless it's someone that you're really interested in or their content is really sticky, for the most part, it's shallow.

Doug Downs (17:19):

And then I move on.

Jess Jensen (17:19):

Yep, yep. But you can hit a wide, wide range of people. However, podcasting, which is almost the reverse, is perhaps a little bit more niche, although I know you know this, but now we've got like 40% of Americans and probably beyond that are tuning in once a month to podcasts. So even though it's been around again for 20 years, it's finally penetrating, I think, at a little bit bigger than a niche, but it still niche versus social. But we go so much deeper. Like this conversation today, we're going to spend 20, 25 minutes talking, and if someone even listens to half of that 10 minutes is far more than they would spend on a single social post.

Doug Downs (18:02):

Amen. So how do I decide which route I want to go? It's great if they're going to listen to me for 10, 20 minutes, but then I got to put all that thought into what I'm going to do to be entertaining or informative across that 10, 20 minutes. Should I go the YouTube route? The challenge with video is video is an enormous resource to put together a good video. Or do I start a weekly or daily newsletter that I blast out? How do I decide which one?

Jess Jensen (18:33):

Yeah, I, and I'm facing this right now with my own business, right?

Doug Downs (18:37):

Yeah.

Jess Jensen (18:37):

How do I best allocate the hours I have in each day? And I'm sure you can relate to this. So my belief, again, this is the same way I'd advise my clients and would, the advice I'd give myself is that start with one thing. Start with something that you already feel comfortable with and get good at that. Get a cadence, get an editorial strategy, build a rhythm around that. And you're obviously fine tuning and iterating as you get feedback. And then as that kind of gets going, add perhaps a second medium and then again a third. But this doesn't need to happen in weeks. It can happen in months. I would actually suggest that you do one thing really well before you add another versus a term I use a lot, which is peanut butter yourself, right across multiple mediums all at once. But you're doing everything at kind of a 50 or 60% quality.

(19:33):

I would rather just start with one. So I know we've talked about this, but I'll just maybe double click on it. The way that I look at social and podcasting, just to start with those two, is they're incredibly complimentary. We were just saying social is a bit wider, but more shallow, and we spend a little bit less time with it. Podcasting is a little bit more narrow, but deep, so we spend more time with it. But besides that, social, if you think about it, is generally very visual, whether it's imagery, video, or copy, you're using your eyes to consume it for the most part. There's of course video that has audio, but generally it's visual. Podcasting, of course is auditory. So it's tapping into a different sense. And in many ways, I believe podcasting is much more personal.

Doug Downs (20:29):

Agreed, by the way. Agreed.

Jess Jensen (20:31):

Yes. And I love to hear your thoughts, but I listened to a tremendous amount of podcasts. I've been a big podcast listener for years. It's where I get much of my news. It's where I hear a lot of deeper dive interviews. I learn so much through podcasting. But I feel like number one, it is the human voice. And again, it's longer form. So you're hearing a more conversational sort of casual tone, which that feels personal for many of us. And then number two, it's quite literally in your ear. So it just feels kind of closer to your body, if you will. And I think there's something kind of visceral about it being in your ear that is really special and unique.

Doug Downs (21:16):

Okay. Want to circle back to, for the executive that's listening, because they hear all this, be authentic, be yourself. Yes, yes, yes. I get it. I get it. And it's hard though. They feel very vulnerable because CEOs, they have bosses, they're called members of the board.

(21:34):

And if they go out there and they act like Elon Musk, they're not Elon Musk, they don't have a billion dollars. A lot of CEOs, yes, yes, they make excellent salaries. 1 million, 5 million, $10 million, but that's the golden goose for them. They ain't estranging the golden goose. So they come off because they feel vulnerable. They come off more staid, more cautious. And I would agree, they don't just want to be themselves. There has to be a modicum of professionality to it. Tell me about executives you've worked with where that's the challenge. Yes, be yourself, be authentic, but at the same time, just unbutton the shirt, don't take the shirt off. If I can use that phrase.

Jess Jensen (22:20):

Yes, that's a good analogy. I like that. So what you're sort of explaining is that the idea behind having a narrative framework, and that's like fancy language, but really it's, Hey, what are the call it? Three areas that I want to repeatedly touch on in my content. And that content, again, like we just talked about, can show up in social, whichever platform you've chosen, it can show up in podcasting, can show up in email as you mentioned earlier, which again is a really lovely space. That's kind of a third leg of that stool because you own it. You own the people that receive that email, which is really different than kind of renting space, which is what we do in a lot of other digital properties. So whatever medium you're choosing, if you have a narrative platform that say, touches on, I want to talk about new news partnerships, product launches, kind of a lot of the traditional things, but really important moments in time for my company check.

(23:18):

Maybe that's one. A second could be I really want to highlight and lift up, shine a light on others, whether it's employees, my team, people that I've met. When I travel around the world, different cultures, I want to sort of shine a light on interesting people and achievements that they've made and my support behind that, for example. And then a third maybe is a little bit more of your vision for the future and whatever the industry might be. So your knowledge and all of your experience, all of your relationships accrue to you having perhaps an instinct about where you think an industry might be in five or 10 years. Maybe you talk about your predictions, you talk about where you see things evolving. Those are just three examples. But if you've got an architecture or a narrative platform and then you use that again consistently across these different channels, you're going to come across as a much more well-rounded and interesting executive, yet still professional,

Doug Downs (24:23):

Well said. And hire a copilot for the journey. Talk to a professional to help weave your way through this. Really appreciate your time today, Jess.

Jess Jensen (24:33):

Thank you. It's been lovely.

Doug Downs (24:35):

Hey, I got one more question. In our previous episode, our guest, Karen Hills, prudent, Dr. Karen Hills, Pruden left a question for you

Dr Karen Hills Pruden (24:43):

Actually, since I am an analytics person. So my question is, what role do you see analytics in transforming the PR business in the next five years?

Jess Jensen (24:55):

Yeah. Analytics is so important. And I believe something that up until I would say maybe a decade ago, it was challenging within the PR and communication space, right? There was much a philosophy around, let's get out the word and then sort of whatever happens after that. We don't necessarily have control or even always visibility to it. Our job is just to get the word out. Now with things like social listening, for example. So being able to read the commentary and the engagement levels, you can effectively use digital platforms like social to do market research, right? To get a pulse on which of our messages landed, which of our messages was controversial and maybe caused a lot of dialogue or questions. And then even in advance of preparing, say a podcast interview or a speech or even an all hands internally, what are the kinds of things that people are really stirred up about?

(25:57):

What are they interested in hearing regarding your industry or your company? How do we weave that into our talk track so that we're actually not just pushing out a message, it's important to us, but we're augmenting that with what we've heard through the analytics tools that are baked now into social platforms. So that's one big one is social listening. Another one, paid media, again, has evolved tremendously in digital paid media. We know leverages a ton of analytics in terms of audience segmentation, being able to ab test multiple headlines, multiple images, and then iterate. AI is only going to accelerate both of these tools. But the PR and communication space, I think has matured and evolved and now moved perhaps from kind of a one-way push. And let's see what happens to more of a, let's put our content out. Let's now listen and let's test and learn, and then we can kind of have a circular sort of iterative process.

Doug Downs (27:00):

Perfect. And the one I think I would add is that analytics are not perfect predictors of the future. They're just the odds. I got that from Monday night football last night. Denver was fourth in goal from the three, and the announcer said, well, the analytics say kick a field goal here, don't go for it. They went for it and they got a touchdown. So the analytics in that case, they got more points because they went against the analytics. Your turn. Jess, what question would you like to leave behind for our next guest?

Jess Jensen (27:33):

Yeah. So I know that you did a fun short podcast around the idea of a bamboo and a bamboo plant. Yes, I'm sure you remember, and I loved the symbolism of how planting a bamboo is similar to growing a podcast audience. And it takes quite a while for the roots to sort of take hold. And then eventually you, and then you see rapid growth with the bamboo. And so my question would be for your next guest, which analogy in nature might you use to symbolize your business and why?

Doug Downs (28:10):

Awesome. And bonus tip, for executives listening, if you do decide to guest on podcasts doing research like what Jess just did and being able to mention the bamboo and the podcast metaphor, the host will love you for that. So digital hugs for that. Jess, thank you for your time.

Jess Jensen (28:28):

Oh, thank you. Great job to you, Doug.

Doug Downs (28:31):

Alright, here are the three things I got from Jess Jensen. In this episode, missed potential. Many senior leaders have joined social media platforms, but they often use them conservatively just as sharing updates akin to press releases or earning synopsis. Jen highlights the missed potential in engaging with these platforms. Community aspects, enabling authentic two-way communication and fostering deeper connections. Number two, showcasing authenticity and personal narratives. Jess emphasizes the value of executives revealing their human side using examples like Frank Cooper, the CMO of Visa. And Sarah Blakely, the founder of Spanx, both leverage personal stories and authentic content, weaving personal interests and relatable moments into their messaging. And number three, choosing the right channels and formats. PR Pros can guide leaders to focus on platforms that align with their audience's habits. Jess stresses the importance of a deliberate, tailored approach rather than spreading content thinly across all the channels, stories and strategies as a co-production of JGR Communications and Stories and Strategies podcasts. If you like this episode, please leave a rating, possibly a review. Big thanks to our producer Emily Page. And lastly, do us a favor forward this episode to one friend. Thanks for listening.